this post got long and is pretty stream of consciousness-y

[nanslice]

imperion and I were being nostalgic last night. Well, okay, I'm perpetually nostalgic and haunt the Wayback Machine like a late 90s/early 2000s ghost, looking up old pages and crying over What Use to Be. It's kind of pathetic, frankly, but that's besides the point. Sparky and I were being nostalgic and sharing our favorite old sites. I was delighted to find that one site that I adored, Bishonenink, was reopened as Bishink! But so many fanfic archives that I used go to are gone. And so many personal webpages, oh man.

I mean, it makes sense! People moved on, the internet grew up. Automated archives make things easier for everyone. Social media grew and fandom seems to have mostly flocked to that. I have a twitter account (rarely used) and a tumblr account (very often used!). I still have a journal (at dreamwidth!). It's not like I've refused to get with the times. But for all the social media that's used, fandom seems so much more fractured that it used to. Even with individual sites and no twitter/skype/what have you, it felt so much more like a community of nerds back then. People seemed much more willing to email each other and sign guestbooks and actually talk about things. Now it feels more like we're just...a number, something to be collected, to boost friend counts and subscriber lists. Which, I mean, sure LJ was very much the same, but with commenting and threads, at least conversations could be had. Now that fandom is primarily on tumblr, things are so...distant. And that seems to work for a lot of people (and I'm genuinely glad for those people!) but I feel pretty adrift.

But anyway. Fandom is different and I am not. And I think that might be the problem, ultimately. As I near 30 (less than a month!) I think maybe my problem is that I'm still longing for the way things used to be instead of dealing with the fact that fandom may not be the thing for me anymore. Maybe I should just. Stop trying so much with it. Give up the ghost. Still watch and read and play - and hell, even write and draw - the things that I want, but give up expecting to interact with fandom. Just focus on the things I want to do instead of trying so hard to be a part of something I'm not sure I want to be a part of anymore.

Another, somewhat shameful problem I have, is that I visit these old websites and I see what the old webmasters are up to and...they've all grown up and moved on. Which is...dumb to be surprised about???? Not everyone wants to be stuck in the early 2000s, Nan, people want to create new projects and have careers and have things happening in their lives. And I know, logically, that I am also an adult and also have things going on in my life. I have a ridiculously awesome painting series happening! I just flew out to Texas to spend time with family! I have an awesome support system of friends - both online and off, if you're reading this, you're great! - who are interested in me and what I'm doing and supportive and excited for me!

But I don't know. I don't know what my problem is. Fandom has always been so important to me. It feels weird that it's not so important anymore. I think I want it to be important because it always has been, but it might actually be a crutch that I'm using that's actively holding me back. Maybe? I don't know.

I think I need to just fold myself into a new project. Maybe that's what I'll do. Maybe that's my actual problem. Feeling adrift creatively, rather than pouring my efforts into a central thing.

Comments

[yoshitsune]

I think maybe my problem is that I'm still longing for the way things used to be instead of dealing with the fact that fandom may not be the thing for me anymore.

Yup, I felt this! And I also think that shifting focus/effort into creative projects that aren't so fandom-y is a good idea. Thinking about it, I really started to put more effort into original writing after fandom moved away from lj... I still miss old fandom life, but a creative shift towards new things can be quite satisfying too.
I hope you find something that works for you!

[nanslice]

I hope so as well! I love adding to a canon and writing/drawing the characters that I come to love from others' sources so I'll probably always keep doing that. But I don't think I want to keep trying to "be part of" fandom anymore, you know? At least today's fandom climate. It's just not fun anymore.

[gamera]

Still watch and read and play - and hell, even write and draw - the things that I want, but give up expecting to interact with fandom. Just focus on the things I want to do instead of trying so hard to be a part of something I'm not sure I want to be a part of anymore.

This is pretty much where I'm at, too. My fannish attention is still there, but in playing/watching things with people and writing things for private consumption by my friends. Interacting with fandom at large is so much more exhausting and less satisfying to me than it used to be-- engaging with strangers on AO3 or Tumblr is frustrating and anxiety-inducing in a way that privately posting things on DW or Plurk isn't.

[nanslice]

Yeah. I don't get too anxious about posting things on tumblr/AO3 but there's just not a lot that comes from it. On tumblr, when people do actually comment about something, it's in their tags. Which I understand, because people don't like adding comments to posts, but it just makes everything even more fragmented.

Oddly enough, I've been getting comments on AO3 recently, but I suspect fandom_stocking might have something to do with that, haha. I'm still very grateful for them.

[novel_machinist]

I know the feeling. I think that it's important that fandom evolves, but there are some things that I totally feel you on. At 33 there are discussions I just won't have; for example I don't see my David Bowie post going well because everything just seems so black and white there. Generally I find Tumblr to be both toxic and difficult to work with. It's just not a platform I'm comfortable blogging on.

Listening to you and others I know that I'm not alone. I don't think fandom as we knew it is dead, it's just had to slow down due to work. What I HAVE found is that "fandom" isn't as important to me as the community is. If I'm with a group of people with a shared interest and having a good time with that, creating with a bunch of others then I am having a great time. :)

[nanslice]

That's it exactly. Tumblr is very black and white, us vs. them and it's exhausting to be in that kind of atmosphere. Plus, I'm i fandom to have a good time, not be attacked because I'm shipping the wrong things. It's pretty tiring. Plus, conversations get so easily fractured by reblogging, it's impossible to keep up with everyone.

Anyway, you're absolutely right. The community is where it's at. I'm willing to buckle down here in DW and just post my actual fic/art on tumblr/AO3 and let whoever likes it, like it, and just not bother myself with the rest of the world.

My friends are here.

[ukefied]

The worst thing about tumblr--besides the prevalent toxicity & stuff lost in translation--is the way it is structured is specifically to produce content and reblog it to the ends of the earth. And people forget that. It was never targeted for conversations or easy discussion and so people get disappointed when using it that way mostly fails.

[nanslice]

YES. Tumblr works well as an image sharing blog (a little too well, in fact; it can be easy to lose control of your work there). It's not a place for discussions.

And that works for so many people. But not me. XD

[novel_machinist]

BING! My wife says the same thing, basically verbatim. The only real talk I see going on there are BNFs holding court or "hug circles"

People seem to find DW intimidating and there's no real good phone version of it, so people shy away from it. There has been some interesting discussion on how Role Play has changed and how different the cultures are on Tumblr as opposed to DW, because people DO use it for discussion and for RP, but I'm at a real loss as to how they keep up.

[ukefied]

Oh, definitely. DW is behind the times with regards to mobile browsing. I think a sizable portion of browsing is done from mobile devices now, and if your product can't be viewed properly or easily, it'll be left behind.

(These days, if I'm not at the office, I'm not on a desktop or notebook at all.)

[novel_machinist]

This reminds me of how I really miss DW RP a whole lot, but time and well...time, are the huge problems for me lately. I need to make it. It's nice to know that I'm not the only one who feels this way

[cephalopod]

HEY FUCKER HOW YOU DOIN

It's been years--YEARS--since I've left a comment on a journal and I'm getting more than a little emotional about how nice it is and how proper it seems. I miss the things you miss, and while I definitely don't want to be stuck with early-2000s internalized misogyny, hangups about actual gay people, weirdness about transsexuality and obliviousness to asexuality, so-on-so-forth, boy howdy do I miss talking to people.

I am glad to get this chance to talk to you. I look forward to doing more of it.

[nanslice]

I'M GREAT, HOW THE FUCK ARE YOU

I'm really glad this post struck a chord with you. ;3; I really miss talking to people too. I love my friends on DW and I love my little journal here. It's nice to have a home on the internet. :3 Early fandom had a lot of things wrong with it, but communication and enthusiasm were definitely its strengths. :3

I actually post here pretty regularly, if my calendar isn't lying to me, so I look forward to talking to you more too! :D

[lassarina]

I would like to thumbs-up this comment forever. THIS.

[ukefied]

I feel so much of what you said here. I'm 32 and was in the exact same boat a few years back. Fandom IS different, though, in many ways. Mostly mobile devices, breezy thoughts, and so many other issues. Meh. People and their interests are allowed to change.

[nanslice]

But change is hard, hahaha. You're right, the current fandom climate seems to be what a big portion of fandom wants. Which means I'm just going to have to have my little corner of fandom right here.

[ukefied]

I really miss 2003-2005 era of fandom. I feel like, for me at least, LJ was at its peak and we were all pretty centralized there b

[nanslice]

Yes. I would say 2003 straight up to strikethrough in 2007, even. Before LJ started to collapse. :(

[tropicsbear]

In some ways, I think fandom has improved, but I understand the feeling of having actual decent discussions that are easy to follow because comment threads.

I don't think that you need to graduate from fandom if you hit a certain age, but also if you feel like you're drifting apart from it, I don't think there's anything wrong with being more chill about participating. Do whatever feels best for you~

[nanslice]

Certainly in terms of social issues, fandom has gotten a lot better. Absolutely. I just wish that hadn't come at the expense of discussions, and also at the expense of, you know, not being an asshole about things, hahahaha.

I definitely don't think I need to graduate from fandom! I think I just need to graduate from trying to hard to fit into a fandom climate that I'm not that comfortable with anymore. And also I need to give up this notion that fandom will someday go back to the way it was, haha. :(

[tropicsbear]

I just wish that hadn't come at the expense of discussions, and also at the expense of, you know, not being an asshole about things, hahahaha.

Hahahahaha TRUTH. (Is it because we're old? I feel like it's because we're older.)

I don't try to push myself to be as fandom-active the way I was before because I don't have the time, sadly :( But I get the feel.

[cypher]

HI HELLO HI

I also miss these things. Like Ceph says, I don't miss all the problems of older fandom, but I wish the move to more awareness hadn't also come with a move to sharks-smelling-blood-in-the-water discourse. I haven't signed into tumblr since... early September, maybe? and I don't miss it in the least. It's such a relief to not have to keep tabs on a battleground all the time.

But that doesn't mean being "too old" for fandom or "growing out of it" or w/e either! I'm 36 now. The woman who got me into the wider world of fandom instead of just Harry Potter was in her 30s when we met, and that makes her close to 50 now, and she's still writing fanfic. It is not and has not ever been a playground for only the kids who think 25 is old. You just maybe shift to interacting with it in different ways.

Do you follow Coyo over here? Her fic journal is at uss_spambot and it looks like she's writing a lot of Stucky lately. In case that's still a thing you are excited about.

I keep meaning to get back to reading and posting on DW and then I don't do so well at it, because depression brain. But maybe I'll give it another try.

[nanslice]

HEY WHAT'S UP HELLO

There are things that I like about tumblr (the meme culture, how quickly your work can spread) but there are a lot of things I dislike about it (how meanness and rudeness get praised, how quickly your work can spread) but overall, it's just. Not really my thing. And I use it pretty regularly but it. Is just so impersonal and fractured for me to really enjoy it too much.

I don't think I could ever give up fandom altogether. I love writing and drawing characters that I already love. I mean, I love my original characters but I think there's a different love for something that didn't come out of your own brain.

I do not follow her! But I've just dropped a comment telling her I'm adding her. :) I'm always excited about Stucky. :)

EDIT: Also, I know depression brain can take hold pretty strongly and not updating your journal because of it is something you never need to apologize for! ♥ ♥ ♥

[cypher]

Woo! I think you will enjoy her stuff. :3

Also I'm finding that having someone else with fandom history in the house is really helpful for enjoying the experience without needing to go fuck with What Fandom Has Become -- gamera and I can chat about how Communist Bae and Agent Throatpunch need to meet or how much Sigurd and Dominia need to hug Ramsus right now and it gets those impulses satisfied without judgy teenagers getting involved at all. XD

[glitteratiglue]

I kind of know what you mean, there nostalgia-wise. I'm close to 30 myself, have been in fandoms for about 12 years, and I feel like today's fandom culture is quite isolating. I remember having tons of conversations all the time on journals, gchat, twitter, etc. Now being primarily part of tumblr-based fandoms, there seems little interaction; it's weird (tumblr taking away replies hasn't helped matters, either).

Not that I don't write/post/meta for myself primarily -- I do -- but I just miss those conversations that used to strike up, even from the ff.net private messaging system.

[nanslice]

YES. Isolating is a good word. I remember fandom being this place I went to to be part of something and actually be with people who shared my interests but now it's like I'm just shouting into the void.

Tumblr is great for hosting artwork and stuff (and i think that's what it was originally meant for) but for any kind of discussion, it's crap. :(

[lassarina]

Like a lot of people have said - I rather miss my early joyous exploration of fandom, like 2003-2006 and thereabouts, and it makes me really sad to look at Tumblr and be like "this is not what I'm here for." I miss prompt comms and the sense of community and all the people we had (I mean, I'm still in touch with a lot of them, but not all and I miss that.)

Like cypher said, it's not that we have to leave fandom at a certain age, I think we just carefully curate our fandom experiences a little more.

[nanslice]

Yes! It really is just decided what we want we want and how we want to interact with fandom.